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Whoa! Jim Webb's Dirty Novel Passages

If you haven't seen Drudge's story yet about the dirty passages from Jim Webb's novels, you won't be up to speed on what is sure to be the talk of the town tomorrow. I will post more later, including some excerpts, but wanted to get this up now since I had three reader emails in my inbox urging me to get this posted.

Update: I seem to remember hearing there was some embarrassing stuff in Webb's novels a while back, but didn't hear any specifics and had forgotten about it. These excerpts are very graphic, and go way beyond "embarrassing."

I wonder if Allen will take some grief for bringing them up now, in the final days of the campaign. Whatever criticism Allen gets has to be far outweighed by the content of those passages, though. There is a serious "ick" factor here. I think a lot of voters will just have to ask themselves if they want to elect a senator with such creepy thoughts running through his brain.

Update II: My apologies to John Hawkins who had this story a while ago and ran several posts about it. I knew I had read it somewhere, but did not remember that it was at RWN. Read John's post -- he has some quotes Drudge doesn't. He has the same take I do on the way it will affect voters, except that I think the passage describing the pedophilia will be more disturbing than the one of the woman chopping up the banana, but that is probably because I am married to a Marine and he has told me similar stories he has heard over the years. Besides that, from what I can tell, both the woman and the banana were consenting.

Update III: Read Paul's post about the "web of bias" seen in the Allen - Webb race. Some in the media went "macaca" crazy and I doubt the coverage of Webb's quotes will compare. Paul also found some additional quotes that raise the "ick" factor a bit. I have posted them in an update after the jump.

Update IV: I thought I posted this last night, but didn't... Sensible Mom was reminded by some of the passages of the horrible things Deb Frisch said about Jeff Goldstein and describes the banana chick as the "woman with the karate crotch."

Update V: The Allen Blog reminds us of the treatment Scooter Libby's writing got from those on the left like Keith Olbermann.

Others blogging:

Ace of Spades

[Some of the excerpts Drudge posted appear after the jump, along with the additional ones that Paul found.]

- Lost Soldiers: "A shirtless man walked toward them along a mud pathway. His muscles were young and hard, but his face was devastated with wrinkles. His eyes were so red that they appeared to be burned by fire. A naked boy ran happily toward him from a little plot of dirt. The man grabbed his young son in his arms, turned him upside down, and put the boy's penis in his mouth."

Ø Bantam Books, NY, 1st Edition, 2001, (hard cover), page 333.

Ø Quote is from para. 10,.Chap. 34.

- Something to Die For: "Fogarty . . . watch[ed] a naked young stripper do the splits over a banana. She stood back up, her face smiling proudly and her round breasts glistening from a spotlight in the dim bar, and left the banana on the bar, cut in four equal sections by the muscles of her vagina."

Ø William Morrow and Company, Inc., NY 1991, 1st Ed. (hardcover), p. 36.

Ø Avon Books, New York, 1992 (Mass-Market paperback edition), p. 35

Ø Quote is from para. 29, Chap. 2 "The South China Sea,", Section 2

- A Country Such as This: "[He] could see Jawbone and Ashley Asthmatic [two guards at a Vietnamese prison camp] napping together in the grass. They faced inward, their arms entwined. It looked like they were masturbating each other. It didn't surprise him. ... It was common to see men holding hands, embracing, playing with each other. Some of them [the guards] had wanted him. He could tell in those evanescent moments between his bao cao bow, the obligatory deference when a guard entered his cell, and the first word or blow that followed it... Quick, grinding voices, turgid with repressed passion. An exploratory reaching of the hand near his groin..."

Ø Doubleday & Co., Garden City, NY, 1983 (hardcover); page 396.

Ø Bluejacket Books, 2001 (Trade paperback edition), page 396

Ø Page numbers are the same in the Naval Institute Press (paperback) edition, 1983.

Ø Quote is from fifth para, Part 5 "A Country Such As This," Chap. 24, Section 1

- A Sense of Honor: "Nurse Goodbody, dark and voluptuous (Lenahan had forgotten her actual name, it was something long and Italian), was a bedtime friend to many of the doctors in Bethesda. She had hinted to Lenahan that she simply could not contain herself. Doctors tending to patients, she explained, aroused her. Morphine Mary (again Lenahan could not remember her exact name) was a thin, nervous drill sergeant type, a disciplinarian who did not allow her patients even to complain. Lenahan was convinced that Morphine Mary did not even sleep with her husband. She wasn't bad looking, he mused again, staring at her thin frame. If she'd just get laid every now and then she'd mellow out and stop being such a damn witch." (p. 164) (Lenahan brings Goodbody home with him and has sex, pp. 188-190)

Ø Prentice-Hall, New York, 1981 (hardcover)

Ø Bantam, New York, 1982 (Mass-Market paperback edition), p. 164

Ø Trade paperback edition, Bluejacket Books, 1995, p. 164

Ø Quote is from fourth para in Part 3, "Chapter 4:1600"


Update: Paul sent me the following additional quotes that no one else seems to have picked up on, which better show the context (or lack thereof) in which the other Lost Soldiers quote appears.

Page 408:

"A hundred meters upriver, then cut to your right, and you will be at the park where the man kissed the little boy's penis."

Page 409:

"Why did he kiss the little boy's penis?" wondered Dzung. "I do not know," said Manh. And then he shook his head, amazed at Dzung's serenity.

Page 423:

"The vacant lot where the man had kissed the little boy's penis was just across the street"

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Comments (39)

Being from Va I thought eve... (Below threshold)
Scrapiron:

Being from Va I thought everyone knew about Webb's novel(s). Nothing is rated below Adult only. It just goes along with the comments he made about women entering the Naval academy. Something like, but not exactly 'Hungry dogs in a meat market full of weiners'. LNAO

Pretty gross stuff.<p... (Below threshold)
Baggi:

Pretty gross stuff.

I'm a worse person for having read it. I suggest to anyone reading this not to go to Drudge and read those excerpts. Gross.

I'm concerned this stuff is... (Below threshold)
Ironman:

I'm concerned this stuff is so incredibly rude it might blow back at Allen for even raising it

Of course, I wonder if this sorta De-Foleyates the House Democrat attacks?

Da** Drudge. he printed too... (Below threshold)
Scrapiron:

Da** Drudge. he printed too much, now everyone won't buy the books and make Webb a rich-er man.

Anyone wonder why he's a democrat? Reagan fired his incompetent a**.

Now the people know the man they almost elected to represent their children.

ROFL

Just love the anachronistic... (Below threshold)
semanticleo:

Just love the anachronistic visage of the sexophobic hedonists gnashing their teeth at the unmasking of their hidden agendas. Go back to the nostaligic Victorian age where pleasure is synonymous with sin.
Cover your privates, and double-lock your wifes' chastity belt while you lust for your neighbors wife and call it compassionate conservatism.

The state of denial is a crimson shade of red.

His defenders can call it a... (Below threshold)
tom c:

His defenders can call it a work of fiction, but he is an author and his writing is part of the whole cloth of a man. It takes some level of depravity to write this stuff, and I would not want to call him my senator.

This is just gross. <... (Below threshold)
kirktoe:

This is just gross.

Living here in Virginia, it's a shame the issues have taken a back seat in this election. But Webb and the Democrats are the ones who started all this by personally attacking Allen.

Now watch them howl in agony when the tables are turned on them.

Boy will I be glad when this election is over (and the GOP is still in control).

Pretty boring stuff actuall... (Below threshold)
TD Larkin:

Pretty boring stuff actually. I can't imagine anyone actually getting excited over that or letting it affect their vote.

Then again, I am a Californian. This sort of thing would probably actually help someone get elected out here. Like the fact that Harold Ford went to a Playboy party; that would be a definite vote-getter out here.

So what would Virginia voters rather have? A racist or a guy who obviously thinks about sex a lot? I guess we'll have to wait until Nov. 7 to find out.

TD Larkin: If Allen is a ra... (Below threshold)
Scrapiron:

TD Larkin: If Allen is a racist you had better sleep light tonight. The ghost and goblins will get you since you believe in fairy tales, or maybe just tales. I've read worse books, but put this with his voiced opinion of women at the Naval Academy and you have someone with a mind to be feared. Guess President Reagan noticed something wrong before he fired him. Most democrats are like the female congressional candidiate in the mid-west. Slick Willie is welcome to come and raise money but he had better stay away from her daughter. Her words, not mine. They don't even trust each other.

Just "pleasure," "boring s... (Below threshold)
Lorie Byrd:

Just "pleasure," "boring stuff", "a guy who thinks about sex a lot"? Are you guys crazy? He was talking about sex with a child. Did you just miss that part? Yes it is fiction (I hope) and Allen probably will get criticized for bringing it up, especially this late, but it really is disturbing to think about that kind of stuff floating around in this guy's brain. I have been sent additional excerpts that put it into context and actually make some of the passages sound even worse. I will post them later.

I think I saw this more tha... (Below threshold)
moflicky:

I think I saw this more than a week ago at rightwingnews or redstate.

does everything drudge links get play in the MSM?

I demand Who knew What and ... (Below threshold)
Soupy2c2:

I demand Who knew What and When? Who has failed our children? I demand hearings, I demand ms pelosi take a lie detector test. Oh wait, its a democrat, oops, never mind.

Na Na Na NaNa Na N... (Below threshold)
drjohn:

Na Na Na Na

Na Na Na Na

Hey Hey

I guess weighing the pros a... (Below threshold)
ted:

I guess weighing the pros and cons for Allen, there was a net benefit for him vis a vis Webb to release this stuff now. The benefit of hurting Webb slightly outweighs the ickyness to Allen of his campaign raising it.

Also, beyond Allen, this could help the GOP elsewhere -- so that must be a net benefit to GOP factor as well.

But my question remains, since this stuff was in his novels, why wouldn't it have surfaced to MSM or been widely publicized before now? Can anyone explain?

How can something published in a widely selling novel be a "surprise"? But I guess it is. I guess even in the internet age, some things remain below the surface of public awareness even if in a published book.

Again, any thoughts on this would be appreciated.

Good point Ted. Where has ... (Below threshold)
Ken Hupp:

Good point Ted. Where has Bryan Ross and the ABC News penis patrol been?

Ken

semanticleo & TD Larkin ~ N... (Below threshold)

semanticleo & TD Larkin ~ Nice that you are unfazed at the depiction of pedophilia, but for most of us, and especially for most Virginians, such as this doesn't constitute part of our daily reading.

I've always maintained that Webb was a nasty little man - and that was when he was still putatively a Republican.

Now, he's a Democrat, so the perverted sex stuff isn't supposed to matter, right?

I didn't read the whole thi... (Below threshold)
Baggi:

I didn't read the whole thing, only the exceprt posted at Drudge, but was it pedophilia or something worse?

The excerpt at Drudge makes it look like a father is molesting his very young son. Double ick.

I have three young boys ages almost 5, almost 4 and 18 months. And the possibility of my imagining them into a novel in this way makes my skin crawl.

A very large part of me now wants to read the entire thing in context in hopes of finding some saving grace, something that makes it not so bad as that short excerpt makes it sound.

"Looking over his shoulder,... (Below threshold)
Daniel:

"Looking over his shoulder, he entered the cave with stealth. The moist evening air was thick with anticipation. He noticed him lying there. The bright Afghanistan moonlight glistening upon his bare bronzed buttocks. Jumbo quietly whispered, "as Allah has said (PBUH) if the meat is left uncovered...shall not the cat eat it?" He moaned passionately. Finally, he could take it no longer and blurted out "Osama, you wild donkey of a man, come away with me and there will be unimaginable delights as we frolic together and hack off heads" Jumbo gently lifted Osama upside down and put his penis into his mouth...

Daniel, that was the ... (Below threshold)
Mark:

Daniel, that was the funniest thing I have read in weeks! It should be on the Onion.

I read my gay lib friends the passages and they said 'Yuk'. They said it's like some fringe 'father-son fetish weirdo gay porn'. They were stunned and appalled.

Webb is done, VA voters will not ignore this.

I presume the worst parts g... (Below threshold)
Retread:

I presume the worst parts got excerpted, that's usually the case. My problem with this isn't so much that Webb has these "creepy thoughts running through his brain", but more that he committed them to paper. In a book. To sell to other people. And now wants voters to elect him. I couldn't put any faith in his judgment. It doesn't exist.

Webb is toast... (Below threshold)
Ron:

Webb is toast

Wasn't Mark Furman's testim... (Below threshold)
lonetown:

Wasn't Mark Furman's testimony impeached because he acted as an advisor to a novel by supplying realistic dialog, which happened to include racially insensitive comments?

ahem... That's a "Webb" of ... (Below threshold)
Paul:

ahem... That's a "Webb" of bias... (groan)

Lonetown (touches nose & po... (Below threshold)
rhodeymark:

Lonetown (touches nose & points) you are correct sir! That very thought went through my mind early this morning. A work of fiction was enough to impeach a witness and help a murderer get off. A lot higher stakes, I'd say - and the MSM WENT ALONG WITH IT.

This WILL hurt Webb in Virg... (Below threshold)
Florence Schmieg:

This WILL hurt Webb in Virginia. You are either a person who can write filth like this or you are not. He chose to write it. It will enter the mix with everything else when voters choose who they want as a Senator. This is appropriate. I hope he loses the election.

He was talking about sex... (Below threshold)
Andy Vance:

He was talking about sex with a child. Did you just miss that part?

This is what happens when you take the Maury Povich approach to literature, Laurie.

Take a breath before you faint.

Yeah he's a sicko. I think... (Below threshold)
Teddy_KGB:

Yeah he's a sicko. I think everyone who goes to Washington has serious problems anyway. On the bright side, at least this was only fiction - and not in the oval office!

But at the end of the day, I think Webb is much stronger than Allen on National Security, and the only issue I care about anymore is the GWOT. That's why I almost always vote Republican, and that's also why I'm voting for Webb. Sicko or not.

By this logic you'd vote ag... (Below threshold)
Lauren P.:

By this logic you'd vote against the author of the Book of Joshua, or Shakespeare, and vote for Janette Oke instead. The reason Webb's narrator describes the apparent molestation scene (see Vance's link, above) is because it startles him, not because he's a pervert. I know y'all aren't uneducated, but are you that naive?

Hey Lauren - I'll assume on... (Below threshold)
rhodeymark:

Hey Lauren - I'll assume on good faith that you aren't stupid either. Reread Allen's press release and you'll see that his context for excerpting Webb's novels is a general characterization of women that reflects back on his Annapolis comments. Webb in his mind is even more of a misogynist throwback then his public comments reveal. The "penis greeting" was visceral bait and I laugh at all you blue rubes that are gobbling it up... err, falling for it.

To the few of you here who ... (Below threshold)

To the few of you here who did not find this writing disturbing: that is just the problem. We have been bombarded with so much of this type of material that you are desensitized to it. "Garbage in, garbage out" is the saying, and our culture is absorbing the garbage at an escalating rate. It is not mentally healthy and it is not good for the country as a whole.

In this country, you do have a right to read, watch and write all kinds of things, but we must have higher expectations. We should demand the very best from candidates for office, no matter the party. Of course, they are human, but as our leaders, we deserve a certain level of honesty and decency and we should not accept anything less.

We need to quit putting up with this stuff all across the board.

To the few of you here w... (Below threshold)
Andy Vance:

To the few of you here who did not find this writing disturbing: that is just the problem.

It's meant to be disturbing. Click on the link I just provided: "It's in the context of an American in an exotic, backward, remote part of a foreign land...It's very obviously scene painting, and the shock and oddity of the act adds to the lead characters' sense that they're out-of-place."

The reason Webb included the scene is 1) to illustrate how much Westerners are fish out of water in the Far East and 2) because it's something he actually witnessed. It's a metaphor for the culture shock Webb experienced while he was fighting in Vietnam, and for the American experience overseas in general. It's a literary device, not an endorsement of the practice, just as Apocolypse Now is not an endorsement of genocide.

If you can't handle such descriptions, I suggest you limit your literary intake to Dr. Seuss.

BTW, the Allen campaign and Matt Sludge are responsible for putting this out for general public consumption, not Jim Webb.

I realize that it is meant ... (Below threshold)
texmom:

I realize that it is meant to be disturbing and I was also aware that he said it was something he witnessed. (And yes, I did find Apocalypse Now very disturbing when it was released, although I thought it was powerful.)

I am also aware that the material was released for political purposes. I am getting sick of that on both sides, but they are not putting out something untrue. The book is out there for public consumption and there is no question that he wrote it. People do have a right to make their own voting decision, and it is up to them as to whether his writing style makes a difference in how they vote.

My point is that some of the posters did NOT seem to find it too disturbing, and I believe that is because our society is becoming so immune to that kind of material. You can get the same point across without going into graphic detail, and you don't even have to be Dr. Seuss to do it!

This content would be considered pornographic by many, in the way it was presented.

but they are not putting... (Below threshold)
Andy Vance:

but they are not putting out something untrue.

It wasn't like Webb was "putting out something untrue," either. So what's your point?

This content would be considered pornographic by many, in the way it was presented.

It was presented exactly the same way in this post. Does that make Lorie Byrd a pornographer?

What I am saying is, althou... (Below threshold)
texmom:

What I am saying is, although I do not admire the political parties constantly releasing all this stuff to win an election, some of what is released is true and some is blatantly false. This story happens to be true, although the motivations for releasing it are not admirable.

As far as the book passages being quoted here, if we commented on something we hadn't read, you would jump on us for that as well, right? So, although it is offensive, she has posted it here so everyone is aware of what the subject matter is.

I am sure you realize that we can go back and forth on this all weekend and will never agree. One thing I hope we can agree on is that just because we see things differently and may have different values, that does not necessarily make either of us ignorant; we simply have different viewpoints.

That's ridiculous. How can ... (Below threshold)
Andy Vance:

That's ridiculous. How can you square this statement:

You can get the same point across without going into graphic detail

with this:

So, although it is offensive, she has posted it here so everyone is aware of what the subject matter is.

What you are proposing, if ... (Below threshold)
texmom:

What you are proposing, if I understand you correctly, is that quoting someone is on exactly the same level as having written it yourself. I respectfully disagree.


So, you would pass around p... (Below threshold)
Andy Vance:

So, you would pass around pictures of sex acts to convince people not to look at pornography, as long as you didn't take the photos?

Not necessary to pass arou... (Below threshold)
texmom:

Not necessary to pass around pictures, because they are already aware of what that is. Citing his book passages was necessary because many people did not know what was written.It would have been possible to describe it in a more subtle manner without citing the passages, but I believe others (perhaps you?) ould then discount their arguments, saying "You haven't even read it; you don't know what you're talking about."

Anyway, I'm tired and it's Friday. Can we argue about this later:)

Since Jim Webb is a Democra... (Below threshold)
tpaine:

Since Jim Webb is a Democrat, the incident described in Lost Soldiers cannot be sexual.

Didn't the erstwhile head of the Democratic party, some few years back, explain that this sort of activity does not constitute "sex"?




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